| Title | : | A Meeting at Corvallis (Emberverse, #3) |
| Author | : | |
| Rating | : | |
| ISBN | : | 0451461118 |
| ISBN-10 | : | 9780451461117 |
| Language | : | English |
| Format Type | : | Hardcover |
| Number of Pages | : | 497 |
| Publication | : | First published September 5, 2006 |
The tensions between factions have been building for some time, and the only reason they haven't met on the battlefield is because Arminger's daughter has fallen into Clan MacKenzie's hands. But a plan to retrieve her threatens to plunge the entire region into open warfare.
A Meeting at Corvallis (Emberverse, #3) Reviews
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Short version: The lights go out, all over the world. No one knows how or why or who, they just know that nine out of ten of them die almost immediately, after which the rest are starving and very few of them know how to farm or hunt. The ones who do form nuclei, small outposts of humanity dotted around the earth. Islands, it turns out, are a good place to be at the end of the world. Cities most emphatically are not. But mostly what you need is a safe place to grow food and someone to show you how.
In the Willamette Valley of Oregon three charismatic, capable leaders, one a Witch, one an ex-Marine, and one a member of the Society for Creative Anachronism create communities in their own images and gear up to defend their territories and their ways of life from conquering armies, raiders, Eaters, and other yrch. I'll get to that last in a minute.
I've read the first three in this series now, after reading the first three books about What Happened on Nantucket at the same time as the Change, as the day everything did is known. Stirling has given a lot of thought to how humanity would react to this scenario. It ain't pretty. Guns don't work and gang bangers turn on the cops. Phones don't work so you wouldn't be able to call them anyway. 747s fall out of the sky. Dams fail and breach. The Black Plague returns, and there is nothing at hand to treat it or anything else, like a splintered bone or cancer. ERs are no longer the last refuge of the sick and injured. You just die. Zookeepers love their inmates and so set them free before people break in to eat them. Which of course means hippopotamus are now living in rivers in England and Siberian tigers are thriving in the wilds of the Pacific Northwest, and all of them consider humans a tasty little snack.
By far and away the most fun part of these three books are the Dúnedain, a, I guess, light cavalry or maybe mounted infantry force along the lines of Tolkien's Rangers, made up of teenagers from the Kilties and the Bearkillers. They speak in Elvish and then have to start making up words for "pee" and "shit" because Tolkien didn't. Beyond the first hilarity, though, it's hard not to take them seriously, because they take themselves very seriously indeed, and it cannot be denied that they are an effective fighting force Aragorn would have been grateful to have at his side at Minas Tirith. Oh, and yrch is Elvish for orc.
What will keep you up nights is the realization of just how fragile civilization is, how delicate and interconnected is the construct that supports all of our lives, how susceptible it is to collapse, and how desperate we would be to find something or someone to believe in. Absorbing and troubling reads, all of them. Recommended. -
This book winds up the "Alien Space Bats destroy powered civilization, aka The Change" trilogy*, which began with DIES THE FIRE (2004). CORVALLIS has moments, but is heavily padded: a Really Dumb space-filler plot-driver features musical-chairs kidnapping of the Bad Protector and Good Witch's kids. Chase scenes follow, la la la.... Bah. The writing continues better than competent, with some good & bloody battles, but perhaps more about Oregon scenery than you will really want to read. Same crappy map as before, too. There's more than a hint of Gwen Drakon's steely elegance in Sandra Arminger, the Protector's consort. Did I mention the Hot Lesbian Sex, featuring a scary Spetsnatz lesbo-commando?
Not one of his better efforts -- though there might be a fine novella here struggling to get out.
OK, maybe I'm being a little hard on Stirling -- I did have fun reading this -- well, sorta kinda, when I wasn't being annoyed with all the goddam PADDING. So YMMV.
"It's a sin to waste the reader's time" -- Larry Niven.
[My 2006 review, first posted to Usenet. Lightly edited, 2020.]
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* This is listed here as the "Emberverse" Series, which is now up to 15(!) books. I stopped here, at #3. -
Third in the Emberverse science fiction dystopian series of an alternative history for the world and revolving around the survivors of an EMP.
It's 2008, and it's been seven months since
The Protector's War, 2.
My Take
Oh. My. God. Make sure you have a TON of tissues before you finish this. I cried great gulping buckets. Even now, just thinking about it has me breaking into tears. A neighbor showed up at my door and was surprised by how much I was crying. Fortunately, she's a reader, so she understood completely. And I really don't see why Stirling had to end it like this. Maybe it'll make more sense in the next story,
The Sunrise Lands.
Jesus, after what the Protector planned for the Lorings and company and what he did do to the Pride of St. Helens captain, he's got a nerve thinking he's entitled to the ship.
It's a world where someone who knows basic skills like farming, gardening, hunting, crafts, engineering, working with mechanical wonders is a treasure. It's a world where most people work for someone else in exchange for food, shelter, and protection. Many hope to save up a small stake so they can afford to stock their own farms. When someone like Sam comes along, the situation makes you appreciate a good teacher (and lord) as he explains how and why he's doing what he's doing for the farm. Which reminds me of a curious thought I've had: how do you determine how much wheat, vegetables, meats, etc., a family needs when you have to produce it all yourself and not rely on driving to the store?
I am surprised that the Mackenzies don't have scouts out around Dun Juniper after events in
The Protector's War. If ever there was a lesson in ambushes on friendly territory!
Oh, lol, I did like Mike's summing up of Jeff Wereton's parental origins. Then he sums up Arminger and the whole Association set-up. You'll laugh. Then there's Nigel and how sweet was the task that kept him at Dun Juniper!
I like the surprises Mount Angel has in store. I've always coveted my own hidden passage after growing up with Nancy Drew and
The Hidden Staircase. Then there are the plans Stirling has in store for young Rudi as well, the way he's going on about him. And how much his enemies are admiring him. A Meeting at Corvallis provides a number of useful experiences for Rudi in how to govern a people and comparing the ruling styles of the Protectorate with his mother's and Uncle Mike's.
It's rather funny how the Protectorate Church demonizes the Mackenzies and brings back the "old" prejudices against gays and people not of the state religion.
Jesus. Juney talks about loosing 130,000 arrows in one 10-minute attack, and that the Mackenzies have more. Enough more that those 130k arrows are nothing.
For obvious reasons, I've hated Tiphaine. And, I've had to revise that hate when I see the changes she makes in her new demense. If only more of the so-called lords had behaved this way… It also seems that she doesn't like the Lord Protector's policies, although she is loyal to Sandra. Well, no one said Tiphaine was a stupid woman.
Oh, boy. Books must be in worse shape than I thought as Rudi talks about how much he loves Donan Coyle.
There are some major battles in this: plenty of action with good tactics, handy weapons, and some useful ambushes. The one at the end is quite decisive and had damn well better be worth it!
The Story
The Protector has been having a bad spring with too many setbacks, and it's all the fault of those Englishmen, the Bearkillers, and the Mackenzies.
Juney, on the other hand, is ticked that people are impugning the honor of the Clan by mistreating Matti.
Pro-Protectorate Corvallans are about to sell the city out to the enemy in exchange for being a charter city. How long that would last is anyone's guess. They're also much too supportive of this new concept of a "select militia". It says something that Mike is against it as he's so angry about constantly being the buffer for Corvallis.
The Characters
This is a very abbreviated list due to space constraints. For a full list, see my
review which is scheduled to be posted on February 25, 2015, on my blog at KD Did It Takes on Books.
CLAN MACKENZIE
Dun Juniper is…
…HQ for the Mackenzies and home to Juniper Mackenzie, the Wiccan Priestess of the Goddess and the Chief of Clan Mackenzie. The core group of the Clan were friends and/or fellow members of the Singing Moon coven. Rudi Mackenzie is her heir, her son, and the now-acknowledged son of Mike Havel. He's also Matti's friend. Epona is the wild horse who took to Rudi in
The Protector's War. Saladin is Matti's unfriendly cat. Old Cuchulain sired puppies: Ulf and Fenra.
Chuck Barstow is the Clan's Second Armsman, the High Priest for the Dun, and Lord of the Harvest. Judy Barstow is his wife, a registered nurse, and High Priestess. And she hates Matti. Aoife Barstow (the former Mary) and Daniel Barstow are what's left of their fostered children, the ones rescued from the schoolbus; they are Rudi and Matti's bodyguards. The third one, Sanjay Barstow, died in the raid in
The Protector's War. Liath Dunling (she used to be Jeanette and is Melissa's niece) is Aoife's romantic partner.
Colonel Sir Nigel Loring (he was with the SAS for 22 years) wears a kilt these days. Makes sense since he's engaged to Juniper. His son, Alleyne, who had been a re-creationist before the Change, is keeping company with Astrid, and Sergeant "Little" John Hordle, who's keeping company with Eilir, are the Englishmen who escaped King Charles III and thwarted the Protector in
The Protector's War.
Dun Fairfax was…
…the Fairfaxes' farm before they died when their insulin ran out. Now Sam Aylward, a.k.a., Aylward the Archer, a former SAS who was hiking through Oregon when the EMP hit, is its lord. He's also the Clan's First Armsman due to his archery skill and his greater skill at building bows.
THE BEARKILLERS IN LARSDALEN ARE…
…a mercenary group, a.k.a., the Outfit, that Mike Havel, a former Force Recon Marine who was a pilot when the EMP hit, assembled, protected, and taught until they got to the Larssons' farm. Now he's Lord Bear and married to Signe. They have two twin daughters, Mary and Ritva, and Mike Jr., their son. Eric Larsson and Luanne Hutton are married. Billy is their oldest; Ken is another son. Ken Larsson, their father, was a CEO and engineer back in the day. Today he's re-inventing the wheel and married to Pam, a vet and the swordmistress. They have two children as well. Will Hutton was a horse wrangler pre-Change, and now he's Mike's left-hand man; Angelica is his wife and handles logistics.
Dúnedain Rangers are…
…a newly formed troop of the younger ones (each Ranger must know Sign and Sindarin) and led by the very skilled and virginal Astrid Larsson, Ken's youngest daughter, along with her soul-sister, Eilir, Juniper's deaf daughter. Astrid has an obsession with everything Lord of the Ring. Asfaloth is Astrid's horse and Celebroch is Eilir's.
MOUNT ANGEL IS…
…the Benedictine abbey where Abbot-Bishop Dmwoski leads. His horse is Sobieski. The Bearkillers follow him for their religious leanings. Father Andrew is one of his. Father Plank is the prior. Sister Antonia is geared up for war.
CORVALLIS IS…
…Oregon State University with their Faculty of Economics the steering committee. They're split between those wanting to placate the Protectorate and those who don't trust 'em. Their primary goal is to maintain the school's teaching functions and not let knowledge die out. Thomas Franks is their president.
Major Peter Jones leads their militia and is inclined toward the Bearkillers and Mackenzies. Pre-Change, he'd been a Society fighter and teaching assistant in the Faculty of Agriculture. Nancy is his wife, and they have kids as well. He'll end up leading the First Corvallis Volunteers with Edward Finney. Seems there's a loophole in the Corvallis charter.
THE PORTLAND PROTECTORATE ASSOCIATION ENCOMPASSES…
…Portland and its surrounding area. But it's not enough for The Protector, the former history professor, Norman Arminger, who has been influenced by the Norman duchy and its offshoots from Ireland to Sicily and the Crusaders. He's absorbed many of the members of the Society for Creative Anachronism (SCA), now called the Society (his Society name was Blackthorn of Malmsey), and many gang members. Princess Mathilda, a.k.a., Matti, is his and Lady Sandra's daughter currently held hostage by the Mackenzies. Conrad Renfrew is the Grand Constable, Count of Odell, and Marchwarden of the East. His wife is the Lady Tina. Sir Buzz Akers is one of the Constable's own vassals. Sir Richard Furness had been a combat engineer in the National Guard. Sir Malcolm, Baron Timmins' son, seems intelligent and ambitious.
Domain of Ath is…
…the reward Tiphaine receives at the end of her successful mission.
The Cover and Title
The cover features Michael Havel in his chainmail holding his war ax, standing front and center with the battered skyline of Portland behind him. A team of horses is pulling a converted vehicle behind him on the left.
The title is a term in the treaty: A Meeting at Corvallis. -
I am not the most ideal person to review this book because I come to it with extreme prejudice. Firstly, I ignored all the warning labels in the Goodreads comments - they told me not to read this book first - the third in a trilogy. I should have listened. More importantly, this book is largely about the Society for Creative Anachronism - a group I was heavily involved with in my younger days (I was a Laurel - one of the folk "A Meeting at Corvallis" describes as a "Period Nazi").
I can't say reading Book three first left me confused, there is so much recap & repetition in it that I can tell you pretty much what happened in the first two volumes. What I didn't get was any sense of character development. I am guessing we were introduced to everyone pre-change, as their wimpy selves .... and over the first two books they armour up to become the impossibly buff and beautiful cardboard cut-outs I was presented with by book three. I suspected I was meant to be air punching as the huge caste of the bold and beautiful triumphed over impossible odds, hacking and slashing their way into legend. Sorry - I just didn't care.
I previously read this authors "Lords of creation" series, which is a camp Pastiche of the John Carter universe. In that parallel literary world, I was willing to accept breastplated amazons as an ironic comment on pre-1950s, pre-feminist Sci-fi. After reading "Corvallis", I think I might be giving Stirling too much credit. He falls for the geek trap of thinking that if he dresses a man in a woman's body, and lets her kick bad arse men, he's writing positive female role models. Lara Croft is not exactly an icon of modern feminism. She's geek soft porn.
My personal background in the SCA made it virtually impossible for me to accept the premise of this book .... hey I could deal with "Alien Space Bats".... I just couldn't believe the SCA could take over their own back yards let alone the world. The amount of belief I was meant to suspend to make this work was frankly, uncomfortable. Combine this with an absurd amount of description about archery, armour, ploughing etc, and it resulted in a book with an extremely odd texture. Crazy realistic detail alongside cartoon superficiality.
Much of this book involves (literally) blow by blow descriptions of battles. I have never been convinced this actually works in print, and long winded descriptions of military campaigns read like transcripts of table top wargames. I guess there are folk out there that enjoy this, but I'd prefer to see this stuff on screen or in a book with diagrams. And in spite of all the violence, I was emotionally unmoved by any of the action.
I read that Stirling is good friends with George R.R. Martin. There are many similarities in the works of these two authors, not the least being long winded descriptions of food. I imagine these writers sitting up late at night swapping fake medievalesque recipes via email to pad out their latest doorstop. They appear to have matching waistlines, and another thing in common .... they both have editors too scared to take a broadsword to bloated manuscripts.
Maybe they should both be forced to hand write in gothic calligraphy on vellum - then we might get books twice as good at half the size. -
I've determined that the first three books 500 page books of the Emberverse series could just as easily have been one 600-750 page book and would have been far more satisfying. Let's consider this volume. It's about a meeting.
A MEETING. Do you feel your heart racing yet?
While the meeting itself actually is interesting as the warring factions in Oregon's Willammette Valley agree to meet to try to broker a truce, it ends inconclusively about a third of the way through the book and we're back to the standard LARPing of the first two books. The major conflicts of the first three books could have easily been condensed into a single, streamlined, well-paced quasi-epic (especially how this third book ended).
People laud Stirling for his "worldbuilding," but I can't. I don't mind the fact that Wiccanism becomes one of the dominant religions in the region. I don't mind that factions/clans try to set up a pseudo-feudal society in the wake of the loss of all advanced technology.
What I mind is that it all feels so FORCED. Remember this book is only 10 years after "the Change" and even though many/most of those who remember the time before have died, there are still more than enough people with memories of the time before that should be able to stand athwart medieval history yelling "STOP!"
Instead of an organic evolution of faith or society into these newfound structures/traditions, it's like the worst aspects of your RenFaire or LARPing group just decided to go full "Medieval Times." ("You never go full Medieval Times").
I kind of wished some of the saner characters would look at some of the major characters and ask: "Why are you talking like that?" -
These books have a great concept, all power sources have failed and guns, bombs, and explosives are now useless. Most people die of starvation and disease but a few people do prosper because they do have the skills needed to survive. Some grab power for personal gain, some gain power due to respect for their leadership skills, some for the religious guidance they can give. It's a brave new world that is created and it's a great world for us the readers to explore.
But honestly, the entire series falls flat after that. Stirling created a great world in order to tell a story in, but he really doesn't know what to do with it after that. Every character is a Mary Sue and has little to no personal growth to go through during the entire series. They don't change or learn anything that helps them grow as people and they're pretty much the same person on page of one of book one as they are on the last page of the third book.
Not to mention all these characters do and say things that don't make sense. And on top of that they KEEP doing things that don't make sense, where as any of us in the real world would see what we are doing is not working, is not making sense or is just stupid and we'd modify our behavior accordingly.
***SPOILERS*** ***SPOILERS*** ***SPOILERS***
So right off the bat the Protector and his wife are yelling at one of their vassals and are insisting that the fact that their daughter was kidnapped is his fault. Moron! YOU are the one who put her on a train going through enemy territory! YOU are the one who planned a rescue that was so poorly put together that it failed and almost got her killed! So how exactly is this HIS fault?
In the next few pages he calls the McKenzies "Satan Worshipers." MORON! They worship different gods than you do! Are Muslims, Hindus, or Buddhists, Satan worshipers just because they worship different gods than you do!?! Of course they aren't!!! Were the ancient Greeks devil worshipers? Were the ancient Egyptians? OF COURSE NOT!!! I'd expect a COLLEGE PROFESSOR who taught WORLD HISTORY FOR 20 YEARS TO KNOW THIS!!! Very shoddy writing.
So then on page six the Protector says that his daughter is being exposed to, "A bunch of fanatics playing make believe." Well if that isn't the pot calling the kettle black then I don't know what is!
Please explain to me why Lord Bear, Juniper and every officer either of their militaries have little speeches they give before their troops fire their bows? For example, "Let the grey geese fly!" Or Astrid yelling something in Elvish. Why not just yell, "FIRE!" or "SHOOT!" What happens if this officer who is used to yelling their own personal catch phrases to get archers to fire their bows has to command another troop who doesn't use that as a command to shoot and they use that command, "Let the grey geese fly!" Then the archers are sitting there scratching their heads wondering what the heck their commander is talking about while the enemy is getting closer or taking cover? See the problem? Plus I timed it, it takes two seconds to say that phrase. From the moment the first syllable leaves the commanding officer's mouth, the enemy knows they are being attacked and knows to take cover, raise their shields or make a run for it. Trained infantrymen can very quickly form a shield wall, and you can sprint pretty far in two seconds so it gives the enemy an advantage. It's just more pointless medieval flare that the author threw in because apparently he's in love with pointless flowery speeches that eventually get people killed.
So moving on, Juniper still thinks she's a witch and that she has magic powers and can cast spells. So she casts a "spell" and tells everyone that if anyone is mean to or threatens or physically harms Matti, (The Protector's daughter whom they have under house arrest), that some ancient boogey-man will rise out of the ground or the oceans and get them. Honestly if I was there I'd walk up to the kid and yell in her face that I was gonna kick her ass, then turn to Juniper and say, "Okay I threatened her, when does your boogey-man get here?" Just to keep driving home the fact that she does NOT have magic powers and that she is just a figurehead that is kept around to be pulled out of storage when we need to motivate people to do something that is in their best interest but they're too stupid to realize it. Much like the Queen of England is right now.
So then the Protector's wife shows up at a city that is in neutral territory in order to negotiate for trade routes and the release of her daughter. And once again the main characters have ANOTHER opportunity to stop the coming war dead in its tracks before it even starts, but they manage to not realize it and mess up their opportunity. Just wait until she is outside of the neutral city with her little entourage, attack and kill everyone in her party but her, and hold her hostage and threaten to kill her if the Protector goes forward with his planned war. And then DO IT when he does, then send him his wife's severed head in a box along with this message to him: "You didn't listen and now your wife is dead because of your own ego driven stupidity. If you continue this aggressive military action, we will do the same to your daughter." Name me one man on this planet who wouldn't immediately order his forces to retreat after receiving a threat like that?
But no, Astrid, Juniper and Lord Bear are too naïve to actually use this opportunity to their advantage and the Protector's wife uses her personal assassin to kill the one man who could actually PROVE that the Protector IS planning a coming war, thus the three leaders of these groups look like completely incompetent morons throwing around accusations that they can't back up with proof, no one believes them and the Protector's men continue with their plans to invade in a few months.
Page 353 What exactly is a "notional border?" Again, no spell check?
S.M. Stirling just isn't very good at writing large epic battles scenes. His battle scenes are just boring and repetitive to the point where you can honestly just start skipping pages. The author's descriptions of a battle scene pretty much boils down to this: Okay, they use this attack formation, other guys have this kind of artillery. The attack fails, they bring out their own artillery, Astrid orders a charge and yells something in elvish..." You can honestly skim over most of the battle scenes because you're not missing anything.
The only time you need to read the description of a battle is when Lord Bear goes one on one with the Protector. And big surprise they both kill each other and the war is over. Great, so the one interesting character in the whole series, (Lord Bear) is dead. Then the Protector's wife takes over leadership of his army and they promise to pull back and they negotiate a peace treaty with Juniper.
So then we get the obligatory funeral scene where Lord Bear is buried and then Juniper speaks at his funeral. She confesses to everyone that she loved him. How do you figure!?! You had a one night stand with him almost ten years ago! And after that you only saw him once every six months or so for like one hour at a time and those times were basically town council meetings! I've got a closer relationship with my financial advisor whom I see roughly three times a year than she had with Lord Bear!
You can also just skip the epilogue. It's just another long pointless description, this time it's of Juniper and Nigel's wedding.
***END SPOILERS*** ***END SPOILERS*** ***END SPOILERS***
I am so glad this trilogy is over, I don't know how much more of this I could take! The first book was pretty good, the second book was okay, this one was pretty much just filler and it felt like the author was just running out of steam in this one.
I may give the works of S.M. Stirling another chance one day, but probably not for a long time. I know there are other books in this series, but I just have no desire to read any of them, or any interest in any of these characters that will keep me coming back for more.
If you really want something GOOD from this author, go check out his Terminator trilogy. That was awesome! This series was just lame and a chore to get through. The author does know a lot about medieval culture, and combat, I will give him that much. But that's not enough to carry an entire series. His storylines and characters just aren't very interesting to read about. -
I'd have to give this installment of the series 3 1/2 stars. It was certainly better than The Protector's War, but not as good as the first book, Dies the Fire. These books should really be read in order, but the main thing about them is they center around an event called the Change. This change made things completely different for human beings. No longer do guns, other weapons, electricity, or other modern objects work. Those who have eeked out a living in this world are strong indeed and include Juniper McKenzie's wiccan archer clan, Mike Havel's Bearkiller warriors, and their enemy The Protector and his vast holdings and enslaved minions.
In this book, a war that has been brewing finally starts. It is the McKenzie's and the Bearkillers, along with their allies who must defeat the mighty horde of the Protector. At first, battle seems to go easy with luck happening for the good guys. But then, in the lull of quiet, Rudi, the son of Mike Havel and Juniper McKenzie is kidnapped along with the daughter of the Protector and the tide changes. They must defeat a large group of the Protector's army and stage a rescue for Rudi with limited resources. This is not all that goes on however. The Rangers are also featured in this book, a group made by Astrid (Mike's sister in law) and Eilir (Juniper's daughter) that helps protect the innocent and scout the forest. They are a valuable team and do a lot of good with winning allies for the group.
The characters are not as fully developed in this book. Rudi is a joy to read about as he is a very interesting character, but he does not feature in this book. The rest just didn't have as much description as they did before and seemed shadows of themselves. The writing in this book on the other hand is very descriptive for everything else. This causes it to be slow moving at parts and Stirling spent a lot of time on unnecessary scenes and people. Also, some readers may be taken aback at the genre of this book. I would classify it as Wiccan fiction, and those going into the book without knowing this, might not be ready for it as they were for a fantasy novel. It doesn't make it a bad book, it just might not be to some people's tastes.
I did like this ending of the trilogy and look forward to reading more of his books about this alternate history. Its an interesting concept and definitely one that should be explored.
A Meeting at Corvallis
Copyright 2006
622 pages
Review by M. Reynard 2011 -
Remember how in the last book I said the blow by blow battle scenes were taking over the book in part cause there was little story and what there was was disjointed? ... well the story slows down EVEN more with even more battle scenes, in fact now we've got a full fledged war going on and we're just going from one battle directly into the next with almost nothing in the way of character development. You have to get to about the 50% mark before ANY story development kicks in. Again there's a lot of jumping around and senselessness... you think the story bits are building to something but they aren't they're just bits... strung together. Its rare that I get caught up in a series and then stop reading it, but this book was so tedious for most of it that I won't be reading the next book
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It’s a been a long time since I read this series. I fight how much I liked it!
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I like the idea of this novel/series better then the execution. And to be honest this is really more of a, "read the first half then the last ten pages and figured out the in between stuf" then an actual complete read. But I'm counting it.
a. The character of Juniper Mackenzie is directly based on
Heather Alexander This wouldn't bother me so much, except it's more of a, "look how cool I am for including this person cause she's just the coolest thing EVER" In other words it's kinda like reading a story in which the person has included his friends and left out the part where they are actual flawed people.
b. The speed at which society adapts to the Change. Not the end of the world stuff, no more technologies thing, the societal changes. The big bad, and you know he's the big bad cause he enslaves people and rapes women (mentioned occasionally and can I tell you how tired I am of this fantasy trope. Yes those are bad things, very bad, but could you have a villain that maybe didn't do either? Please?), has set up a feudal type society. With peasants and everything. Now this particular book is set five years after the Change, when electricity and gunpowder stopped working, and in the northwestern US. I'm just supposed to believe that American citizens just went along with this? Now this really isn't dealt with in the novels, because he's not the focus, but I have a hard time believing he didn't have several 'peasant uprisings' to contend with. Sure the writer asserts that hungry people are more subduable, but um... I just don't buy it.
c. It's kinda boring. And I'm not sure why. Partly I think because the battles/strategies that are a large part of the book are not my cup of tea. And really, if I can figure out the middle parts of the book from reading the first half and the last 10 or so pages, there are some problems. Ok, so I do this a lot, and I am frequently able to figure out the middle parts, but if I don't care to go back and actually read what happens, then there is a problem.
The things I like, and mean I'd probably read the next one if I can get it in the library: The characters. Once you get past the whole "I'm so cool for including this person" thing with Juniper Mackenzie, I really do like the people here. And I do like the idea of people trying to survive after technology stops working. -
"AMaC" picks up immediately after "The Protector's War." The two could probably be considered one story in two volumes. Curiously, there's more war in AMaC than there is in TPW. As one might expect, things go progressively downhill for the Allies, who are still collectively militarily outnumbered three to two by the Protectorate army. We see some more major plot movement, the resolution of some of the sub-plots from TPW, plus the introduction of some new ones. It's clear that the author intends the story to become an epic saga of mythic proportions. That's fine, because I'm rather fond of those, provided they're interesting, and I find that the Emberverse continues to be so. It also helps that the series takes place mainly in Oregon. It's hard to be driving down I-5, see signs to Corvallis, and NOT think about the city's wall and the OSU Beaver becoming its battle standard, or the exit sign to Gervais and NOT think about the Barony Gervais, or going south on 99W and NOT think about "Okay, this is Protectorate land, and now I'm in Bearkiller Territory..." It's just so much fun to be able to connect events in the book with real places in my back yard! (I even took a drive through McMinnville and thence down to Salem to see if I could find Larsdalen! Results are inconclusive, but it was still fun to do that.) I also like to ponder, as I drive around, how certain things have changed in the real world since DtF was written in 1989 and how those might have affected the aftermath of the Change--the population explosion in Bend and Redmond, as well as the popularity surge in the self-sufficiency movement in Oregon specifically come to mind.
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After a strange physics-related apocalypse, wiccans, ren faires, and Tolkien geeks take over the world. And... meh. I found just enough to enjoy in these books to keep me reading until the end, although I'm not sure whether I'll get around to reading any further into the Emberverse books than this (these first three stand as a self-enclosed trilogy). Other reviewers have detailed their issues with problems like the preponderance of coincidences, the pacing, the skills everyone magically possesses, the sexism, etc., and these points are pretty much all valid. If I wasn't such a huge fan of apocalyptic fiction I definitely wouldn't have ground my way through these.
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I am done with this series.
A Meeting at Corvallis, the third book in first Emberverse trilogy, unfortunately didn't return to the magic of the 1st in this series. Too much battle info-dumping, not enough people behaving believably.
(That said, I did cry at the death of one of the main protagonists near the end of the book)
But I'm just done. If I want the minutia of military campaigns and what people ate, I'll go read some L.E. Modesitt Jr. At least his villains aren't such caricatures. -
If one is invested in the series this is a solid conclusion. I know the series continues but this will be my stopping point, I remember the quality going down hill in the 20 year later books.
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I keep reading the books in this series, and I keep rating them low, and yet I keep wanting to read the next one. Maybe there's something wrong with me. Maybe these are just "guilty pleasure" books. I roll my eyes at least once per chapter at how thick the author is laying it on with the tired tropes and cliches. And yet... there's a wonderful escapism to a fantasy that takes your home and makes it into a swashbucking fantasy of swordplay and palace intrigue.
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For those into the post-Apocalyptic genre of novels this is a must-read addition to your reading list.
Thanks to Mary Jane who recommended Dies The Fire oh, so many years ago. -
This book continues the chronicle of the Portland area after a complete technological collapse. The idea is original and Stirling has created some interested characters, but overall the book was a bit disappointing.
As with the previous volume (The Protector's War), he creates a complicated storyline rich with vivid characters, but he fails to deliver. It felt as if Stirling decided to end the book rather than to pursue many of the various subplots that he sparks. In the last one hundred pages he provides simplistic closure for most of these story lines.
In particular the fate of the Lady of Ath, who swore a horrible vengeance against another character, quietly gives up her quest for revenge in exchange for the easy life. Now while such a choice is not wholly unbelievable, the character makes this switch with such alarming alacrity that I found it quite unbelievable. His treatment of this subplot exemplifies many of the problems Stirling has with his narrative. He has such a fertile imagination and did such a good job keeping his narrative moving forward and exciting that the ending was a complete letdown. Too much was left in the air and too many subplots were summarily ended.
Finally, the major conflict of the book ends in a somewhat unbelievable manner (although I don't have any major problems with it), but the underlying causes of the feud between the Protectorate and the states to the south are quickly resolved in a five page discussion (or rather ultimatum). It struck me as sort of a deus ex machina ending. -
This book concludes the first story line in Stirling's Emberverse series. In the story he builds up two big plot lines one which revovles around the big conflict between the Protector and the indepedant states in the Willamette valley and then the small conflict around Rudi and Matilda the two young heirs. Along the way we learn more details about Corvallis and the Mt Angel groups as well as watch the reavling of the various plots and counter plots weaved by the warring factions which all leads to the final confrontation which I admit the resolution suprised me the first time I read this and is a great ending once the shock wore off. I really liked how this story arc gets wrapped up in this book and Stirling does a superb job of wrapping up story threads and setting up the next story arc. The end of the first three books in this series is a complete story that does not need to be followed up with the other 4 books of the series and it is something that appeals to me about the series above and beyond the story itself. That being said I do recommend continuing to read the series but it does add some more fantasy elements and the main characters shift from the orginial ones to the children of the main characters. I thought this was a good choice on Stirlings part and kept the series fresh for me.
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Skimmed to complete trilogy
I enjoyed most of the first book in the trilogy (Dies the Fire), however I found the second two books a great disappointment and found myself skim reading this one just to complete the story arc.
I liked the original concept of the enigmatic Change, knocking out all modern technology and firearms and turning back the world to that of the Middle Ages. I also liked the meld of fantasy, medieval sword play, and Wiccan religion. I felt invested in some of the original characters, particularly Juniper and Astrid.
However, I thought the books to be quite badly written and hugely repetitive, much of what was written repeated the same information over and over or did not advance the story arc. Also, some of the characters seemed very inconsistent from one book to the next or changed because of plot devises rather than due to explored character development. I though the character psychology and relationships very weak.
I finished the trilogy because the story intrigued me enough to want to find out what happened. There are several books in this series after the original trilogy, but while I might like to find out what caused the original change and what happens ultimately to Juniper, Astrid and Rudi I don't think I will read further. -
This was a frustrating read for me -- there were still things I really enjoyed, and things I think I *would* have enjoyed if they'd gone just a little bit differently (I wish I'd felt less conflicted about Tiphaine, because she had the potential to be really my type). But the overall impression I got coming away from it was that Stirling had pulled an Andrew Eldritch.
(Context: Andrew Eldritch created the Sisters of Mercy, one of the foundational bands that defined the goth scene for years. There's a whole subset of goth rock that sounds like people trying very hard to be the Sisters of Mercy. And Andrew Eldritch hates goths. Loudly, spitefully, without exception.)
There are two kinds of audience for this series, I think -- alternate history buffs who read a lot of wars-that-went-differently, and fantasy fans who are drawn to the do-away-with-modern-technology element here. I'm making sweeping generalizations, but those are the broad categories.
And Stirling has been dropping hints throughout about which part of his audience he prefers, but the final confrontation in this book made it really, really explicit.
Contempt for your audience is a dick move, Mr. Stirling. -
I've been writing reviews of stand-alone novels for a long time now, and I think I know how to avoid giving spoilers, by describing the basic premise without giving the plot. But the problem with reviewing a later book in a series, is that even the basic premise can contain what would be a spoiler with respect to one of the earlier books. That is the case with these books of "The Change", so all I can really say is that this one follows very closely on The Protector's War. Be sure to have both books on hand when you get started. Stirling must have written them together; the writing has exactly the same strengths and weaknesses for me, as I previously described in the earlier reviews. There is a conclusion (in fact, it gets a little sappy at the end, I think), and yet it leaves open the seeds of the further sequels.
But no progress at all, towards understanding why or how "The Change" happened in the first place. I keep waiting for the intelligence behind the concept to interact in the plot, but there haven't even been any clues laying the groundwork for that. Maybe it's time for me to read some real science fiction again. -
Somewhere in the middle of this you realize that you are TOTALLY ATTACHED to these characters and their well-being. It sneaks up on you, which is delightful. For anyone who enjoys a good bit of swashbuckling as well as some fantastic commentaries on human interaction, this is a great read. It will never earn five stars from me, though, as there are a number of times when I just want Stirling to get out of his own way. With his continuing editorializing about religion (although here the Christians finally got one awesome paragraph of standing up for themselves, huzzah!) and the pages of I-did-so-much-research-you-can't-understand notes, I just felt like I kept getting kicked out of the story by the author. The ending was heart-wrenchingly great, though, and I believe I will read the sequel trilogy he has, as these characters are very well fleshed-out.
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What a series. Sometime during book two (The Protector's War) I became totally obsessed. The writing is a bit sloppy (he tends to cut off in the middle of action and jump to a scene after its all finished, relating how the last scene ended through inferences) in places, but I really love the universe that Stirling has created. And I can't help but imagine him sitting around at the pub with George R.R. Martin discussing their books. (They are apparently friends.) I would recommend the series to anyone with a penchant for post-apocalypse books, though if you are a lit snob (as I am on some level) it can sometimes be hard to swallow. I can't wait to start the six-book series that takes place in the same world a generation later.
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It is year 8, after The Change. People are trying to survive, relearning how to grow their own food, protect themselves from marauders and warlords. The Bear Killer Clan and Clan Mackenzie are separate but close, with a mutual pact to assist when the self-styled Protector once again sends his forces to conquer them.
Lots of details with regard to primitive survival, and a surprisingly strong emphasis on worship of the Goddess.
Characters are well drawn and strong, and the plot is clear and pointed, with one small exception at the end.
It has cliff hangers though so beware. I'm having to hurry up and read the next book in the series right now! -
Oct2021 - 2nd listen
Even though I know how it ends, it still made me tear up. Such a good book. Moving right on to the next one.
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Oct2013 - 1st Listen
Wow. What an ending to this first trilogy! I admit I cried. I think the next 3 start 10 years after the end of book 3. I'm taking a breather for a bit to clear my palate but will definitely be reading/listening to the next 3. -
This series is a guilty pleasure series. The writing is atrocious but the plot is creative enough, with an Oregon setting, to make it fun. I will admit this one has a better grasp on the world and characters. It is not constantly justifying itself like the first two. And the action is well written, battles are tense and brutal using creative medieval and modern tactics.
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Third book in the series. More ridiculous Wiccan rituals and excruciatingly detailed and graphic battle scenes. I am hanging with this series now, because I am familiar with the characters and like the author's occasional descriptions of the "post Change" world, i.e. I feel somewhat invested.
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The series grinds to a slow, sputtering conclusion. If you read the first two then you'll want to read this one, but you'll probably feel a bit disappointed at the end.
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I cried.
